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Delaware Legion Ball vs Semi-Pro

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8yaz

Top 100 Prospect
Mar 22, 2007
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I suppose it depends on which two teams are playing, but generally speaking where are you going to see the better baseball during the summer in Delaware at a Legion game or a Semi-Pro game?
 
You can't be serious. Legion is very good ball but semi-pro are the all-stars of legion. Those still having their 16-18 yr old kids playing travel ball need to wake up and check out legion.
 
This isn't a good debate at all. Semi Pro basbeball
in Delaware is 18-? and is filled with great players
and are college kids and ex pro players that
are playing for the love of the game. Of course,
there isn't any comparison. But Legion offers
the kids who haven't reach there goal yet. It's excellent
baseball and this year Legion teams are filled
with DE HS all state players. Parents who
still have their kids playing travel ball from 16-18
are very misguided and may be selling some
pipe dream to their kids. Who coaches who
make good money to have teams. Look at Caravel
who have a summer team called the warriors
Which I hear is pushed on their HS players at $2000.00
a piece. I would say its another way to help them
recruit players. Any travel ball coach who played
college baseball should be ashamed of selling this
dream of going to D1 schools. I would say ask
any current D1 coach what year there recruiting for.
I would guess they would tell you they are committing
kids from class of 2015 already. Why would
you send you're kids to play in the SEC territory when they
could play local for the Legion team and get recruited
by very good D1-D3 schools in our region. Of course,
there are going to be talented kids like Fraley who
Get looked at but I would think this doesn't happen often.
Maybe play for something that means something like their
local Legion team. Play for area and win
 
Play for you're area Legion team that has kids who
play baseball together in HS, being a championship
To you're town. There are some many travel teams in DE and you see
so many DE kids play for NJ , PA and MD travel teams. Tell me what
D1 schools go to all of these big showcase tournaments
and recruit. Why would one of our local college coaches drive down to
GA to watch a DE kid play there when they could
do it much easier from a legion team. What I laugh at the most is look
At the college commitments for this year and you
will see they are still playing travel ball. My question is once you
committed to a school why still play travel. Image
The legion teams who be like if they played locally. If you look around hard
enough you will see kids committing to Maryland and LSU and where are they playing now.
I heard there playing for local big league teams which are several steps below Legion ball. I
would to them wake up and play for you Legion team and have some town pride.
As for semi vs Legion. I would put Stahl Post to beat most of the semi pro teams if
not all of them. They are legion powerhouse team. Just saying
 
Some good points. It would be nice to see more of our top players play Legion. Then maybe the quality of the championship team that Delaware sends to the Regional tourney would be able to represent the state a little better than we have in past years. When's the last time a Delaware Legion team had any success at the Regional level?
 
Trust me when I say Stahl can hit the ball and
have some team speed . Newton is a stud pitcher
for them and probably should have 1st team All State
 
Stahl is not a better team than any of the semi-pro teams! Not even close! Boys playing against men! Stahl and most of legion do play on much better fields.
 
Im not sure why we are bashing travel ball. I feel like im in a wayback machine. Travel ball is the main process getting kids noticed these days. Yes, its expensive, but i don't think most if any of the teams are making any money and of all the teams i know of, the coaches don't pay themselves. If any thing, they are reaching into their own pockets to keep the teams going. Not to mention all the time they spend away from their families coaching, but also doing the administrative work. Filling out paperwork for each tourney, insurance, finding fields, tourneys, communications, etc. I did it...its a thankless job.

Besides getting noticed, travel ball is mostly for fun...and the thrill of going on the road. Playing on different fields, in different places. In some cases going to these bigger national tourneys and playing against some of the best kids in the country. A lot of teams include a "vacation" tourney where they go to a vacation spot like florida, virginia beach, myrtle beach. A lot of the younger teams go to cooperstown or basball heaven or other great baseball facilities.

Another great aspect of travel ball for high school kidsl is TRAINING DURING THE OFFSEASON. The travel teams are training all winter long getting the kids ready for school ball. It is very hard, if not impossible, to do training on your own. Remember that most dads are just dads, not baseball experts. High school teams can't "practice" with the kids in the off season and i don't think any legion teams do any off season training.

If you notice i'm not bashing legion. I love baseball and i think the kids and young men should play as much as possible for fun. Whether its travel, legion, little leage, school ball...WHATEVER. If i had my way i would love to see all the organizations work together so that the kids CAN do some or ALL if possible. That way they don't have to choose. Little leagues are falling apart because they are losing kids to travel. Some of the smarter little leagues are trying to be flexible to allow the kids to do little league and travel by trying not to schedule as many weekend games so kids can do both. I think legion teams are pretty flexible allowing kids to be on the roster but a lot of times miss weekend games.

I just think the bigger picture is that Delaware needs to work together on getting more kids noticed and playing by allowing a streamlined process of training, developement and playing to give the kids the full experience. Not by doing one or the other. But by organizations like little league, school ball, travel and legion working together.
 
OS, I'm with you. Travel ball gives kids opportunities they wouldn't get in legion ball, travel, better competition, acess to scouts and recruiters, etc. toe the rubber, your question about why a scout would travel to Georgia to see a kid from DE is easy to answer. The scout will see not only the kid from DE, but 100 other very good ballplayers. Scouts have budgets too. Unless a player is the second coming, a scout isn't going to attend a legion game to see one kid. He'll go to a showcase event where he can see hundreds.
 
Sports and Old School are right on target, the public school baseball experience is one where you might have the Science\Gym\Janitor coaching the team. Let's face it, these folks are not looking out for your kids future if that player is looking to play past High School. The competition is much higher at Legion and Travel along with the fact by playing different venues the players actually have the chance to be seen by someone other than a coach from one of the local colleges. The Awards selection process done at the end of the year should give you a good indication of why kids are looking to play somewhere other than their High School Teams. Look at the Public Schools that win 75% of their games only to get bounced out of the states in the first or 2nd round every year by the private/tech/charter schools, parents\players are seeking out programs with coaching commodities not offered by public schools. Programs that facilitate learning\growing their skills for play at the next level, programs where players have a chance to get exposure and leadership is more focused on their futures

WT
 
I agree with your points but I coached in College
in the Northeast region and we never went
to these south travel ball showcases. We recruited
Talent from our region and yes went to Legion games bc they
play in our region. Want to get looks from local
colleges have to play local. I agree travel ball
is great but it's best for 10-15 yr olds. I coached
a showcase travel team and I saw first hand how scouts
and colleges came to these events looking for
kids they already knew about. After they saw them
they left the fields. College recruiting is mostly
Done by the parents or HS coaches sending video to
The college recruiters . The one thing that is not
being mentioned is that it's important to have the grades
to get into these colleges. You can have some great
talent out there and these travel ball coaches just sell
if you play well you will get D1 offers. Well, you might
get the look but have to pass the grades. Legion teams
are extensions of the HS teams bc they have kids
on there local legion team. But I think all of your
points are valid, but I can assure you 100% that
they have to hear about you before they come look. We got
100's of video and based on the video we would
go look. You just don't go down to GA on a scouting mission
Blind to find talent. For one the school isn't going to
pay to travel that far without telling them who you're looking for.

Just my 2 cents
 
I don't want to come off as I don't see anyone's points or comments and I could
be wrong for Delaware, since I really new to the area. I guess we should ask or research
how many DE players have been recruited to play for any ACC, SEC or D-1 major
schools from these travel ball showcases. I hope everyone realizes that College coaches
hold showcase camps at their schools throughout the summer, which is like a second
income for them. These in house showcases is where a lot of recruits come from. I have looked
at the College Commitments listed on DE preps and I see most DE kids are going to
schools in the northeast colleges, with a few exceptions, but only a few. Based on what
I see there is that these players are getting looks at HS fields, based from video sent
into the coaches, and local leagues within the State. All Star Academy holds summer showcases
I'm different areas of DE,NJ and PA so some come from that too. I think it's fair to say, if
each of you did the research you would find that not many local kids are getting
these big school offers from travel ball from Sports at the Beach . To answer that
travel ball teams aren't making money isn't very true. Yes maybe your local travel ball
teams might not be bc it's what I call "Daddy Ball", which means that a Dad
started a team bc his son could t make it on a Legion team so they start a travel ball
team so their son can play every game. How much good baseball training are they
really getting. Most Legion teams are run by ex ball players who don't have sons
on there team. If you play for a big squad like DE Warriors then they are paying
there coaches a salary while the Caravel coaches sit back and coach from the sidelines.
Convince players to pay 2K and they will get them college looks, while all along they
are charging extra money to give private lessons. So money is being made! I can assure
you of that. I have been there for a New York travel team. I would challenge each of
you to do some research and post what you find. Look at DE Diamonds, Tri State Aresnal , NJ
Young Guns etc... Tell me how many of there players go to D1 schools. Bc I can
tell you that no D2 or D3 colleges are running around to summer travel ball showcases.
 
I believe everyone has touched on some good points here. I think travel and Legion offer good opportunities for players. Some families may not be able to afford travel ball, so legion may work. Travel does get kids a chance to play at different venues, experience things local ball may not. Kids create long lasting friendships traveling and lodging with players. However, travel definitely not a must for college recruitment. Everyone knows many travel teams are started because JR could not make a quality team so there are more bad organizations then good out there. Then once Daddys son moves on the team no longer exits. Regarding pay to travel coaches, Yes most travel coaches are being paid one way or another. I have seen travel coaches pay themselves by having their kid play for free. I can assure you coaches on the better teams are usually getting paid and coaches on the nationally known teams are getting paid. That is fine they are doing you a service and you usually get you moneys worth. You are not going to get looks at Sports At The Beach, East Coast Travel Baseball, local small tournaments in DE or MD. Anyone that has done travel knows much of your success is luck on what teams are in your bracket. I continue to see older DE teams 15-17 that brag about winning these types tournaments (even on this board). Sure play them for the love of the game, but don't sell yourself as getting your players looks playing these tournaments. You will get looks at travel if you do the right tournaments, but coaches come to see certain teams as much as players. As soon as these teams are finished playing they pack up.

The comment about High school coaches is dead wrong, and could be made about many coaches at all levels.

One thing I believe is true and helps and argument for some type of involvement locally beyond high school........IF the player is not getting some interest locally what makes you think the will get interest outside of DE. All the players recruited outside of DE I am sure have had some local interest before or during their recruitment process.
 
Originally posted by oldskool42:

Little leagues are falling apart because they are losing kids to travel. Some of the smarter little leagues are trying to be flexible to allow the kids to do little league and travel by trying not to schedule as many weekend games so kids can do both.
Click to expand...
Newark American Little League didn't even enter a team in the 2013 District II Senior Baseball Tourney.
 
That's a shame about NALL not entering the Senior Tournament. Hopefully it's just a one-year absence. I do know several of the older NA kids are playing Legion now.
 
I agree with everything that is being said here for the most part. Is there a right answer, not sure!
All I know for sure is that there are travel teams doing well and making good money at it.
I have heard some of the Legion players missing games bc they are playing for Niggabruager Warriers
team, which I'm sure he isn't coaching -- yea right. What is he selling to them for $2500 per
player bc 9 of the 14 has on his roster already have D1 -D2 college commitments so
why aren't they playing for their local legion team for town pride. Travel ball has been good
to the love of the game, but not sure what type of coaching there getting from your average
travell ball coach. Most Legion managers are ex-pro and college players so I would
think there getting good instruction. I know for sure that most who are still playing travel
ball from 16-18 are playing bc they would most likely not be the star of their legion team. I think
The big problem is the kids have this dream of going to the big time and think that
there is something better out there. I raised this question before and didn't get an
answer? How many DE travel ball players get D-1 baseball commitments that last until
they graduate. Can anyone name more than 5 DE kids that have gone to a big D-1 program
and made great career there. I cannot think of anyone. Fraley could possibly do it. Funderburke was
There were others in NCC that did well but stuff happen to stop there dreams. Looks
like UD got who they wanted already so what know. I guess try the D-2 level but to
most of these young men this is a step down. They have said to be that there travel
ball coaches are guarantee them a D-1 roster spot if they play for them. The. Any travel ball team
has a Dad doing it to propel there own kids before anyone else on the team so I'm sure
there being fair. If they want to have a great team then the rule is surround your kid
with talent so your kid plays on a good team. Groups have called themselves a Christian baseball
team with idea of instilling Christian believes and values, but watch them play and
you will so that the coaching staff don't act like that at all. I'm sure everyone knows
who I am talking about in our area. Bottom line it's up to the individual player to chose
what he wants to play, but I just would ask don't sell something to them that you don't
know about. Just let them play. If there D1 caliber the college will find them. Just let them
play baseball for the love of the game
 
Let's be real. Very few, Delaware HS baseball players end up making a living playing baseball. Another option would be to choose a college based upon academics and one that will put them in the best position to succeed after college. If they still love playing baseball, they can play club ball at the university.














This post was edited on 7/12 7:43 AM by 8yaz
 
Rubber21.....Every point that you have brought up is, I believe, pretty accurate. No need to even talk about the Daddy Ball thing as that has been exhausted!!! As far as the boys playing out of state, in Georgia..., I think there are more scouts, both MLB and College looking at the boys than you may think. Obviously, the MLB scouts are there to look at a specific kid, the college ones may be there looking at someone in particular but they may also find someone with talent that hasn't been recognized. I took your challenage and looked up the 3 travel teams that you mentioned and this is what I have come up with (not sure that I am exactly on target but I am very close) DE Diamonds...I don't see where any boys have committed to a college and that may be because they are a little younger. Tri-State Arsenal - I looked at their Showcase 1 and I see where 6 boys, possible 8, are committed to a D-1 school. SJ Young Guns - looks like there is at least 1 but I believe their roster has really changed over the past year so I may not be able to see some of the boys that may have committed, that were actually on there prior to this past year. This was a great conversation.
 
Yes I agree with what your saying also. In my experience, if you haven't been signed
before your Senior in HS by D1 then start looking D2 or D3. In my opinion and from
I have seen how many D2 roster have a lot of non state players on it, which it's mostly
in state talent. Yes I agree MLB scouts are all over the place but I guess I was referring
to more college scouting. I would say most of the kids getting looked at our pitchers, which is
the easiet way to get looks. I'm really not against the travel ball teams and my only
knock on them is that they are comprised of non and in state players where Legion
is an extension of HS players from their state. I guess my other concern is that travel
play in the age bracket and you only getting better by playing with some older players.
My biggest problem is travel ball players are those kids who have already committed
and still go play in travel ball team tournaments . If you have already committed then
why play travel ball bc isn't that the reason you play travel it to get the looks.
To give you an example of Legion players, look at Stahl Post they have 5-6 players committed
to play in D1, along with Fox Post who have 4 players going to D1. Every legion
team has these types of players so why wouldn't a parent want them to play against
these kids locally. This is a true measure how your child matches up with DE elite
players. The league is compromised of 15-19 year old kids and quite frankly if you
haven't give a verbal commitment by the summer of rising Senior year then your
probably not going D-1. There are plenty of D-2 and D-3 colleges coming to Legion
games to scout which is probably more realistic for our in state players. I agree with
a lot of people's comments and mine our based on my own experiences and opinion on
how the process works. Enjoyed these posts
 
The thing with travel/summer ball is that those coaches do tend to know the depth of their players much, much better.
This post was edited on 7/28 4:04 PM by See ya ball
 
Originally posted by Old Ram:
That's a shame about NALL not entering the Senior Tournament. Hopefully it's just a one-year absence. I do know several of the older NA kids are playing Legion now.
Click to expand...
NALL will be back with a Senior Tournament Team next year.
This post was edited on 7/30 5:39 AM by oldtimer22
 
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