Remember, ALL the other sports in the state (every season) were being held hostage by the football Gods. That was the reason everything went to a condensed 3 season solution. DoH said football was a go and everyone was allowed to play. If Sallies get their way and football is done, will all the other Fall athletes lose their seasons again???
So we’re two weeks out from first games.....
- Thread starter delawarenole
- Start date
Here is the play off set up...as voted on
4 teams each division
Conference champ must have a .500 record or better to receive auto bid
Must play min. 5 games to qualify
points..
D1 6 win 3 tie 1 for loss
D2 4 win 2 tie 0 for loss
1 pt bonus for playing an opponent that wins 5 and an additional point for 6+ wins
Covid prohibitions run down like this
If one team is prohibited from playing a game, it will be ruled as a forfeit victory for the scheduled opponent. But that opponent could decline the forfeit and – with the approval of football committee chairman Jim Comegys and DIAA executive director Donna Polk – schedule a game against another team with an open date that week. If both teams are not able to compete, it will be considered a tie and neither team is penalized
4 teams each division
Conference champ must have a .500 record or better to receive auto bid
Must play min. 5 games to qualify
points..
D1 6 win 3 tie 1 for loss
D2 4 win 2 tie 0 for loss
1 pt bonus for playing an opponent that wins 5 and an additional point for 6+ wins
Covid prohibitions run down like this
If one team is prohibited from playing a game, it will be ruled as a forfeit victory for the scheduled opponent. But that opponent could decline the forfeit and – with the approval of football committee chairman Jim Comegys and DIAA executive director Donna Polk – schedule a game against another team with an open date that week. If both teams are not able to compete, it will be considered a tie and neither team is penalized
Whatever happens will likely alter the course of Delaware High School Sports, not just this year, but possibly forever. If Sals isn't granted an injunction, do they stay in DIAA? What happens with the Ab? If they are, what does it say that a lawsuit less than two weeks before a season is set to begin can force a change, especially if that program has been largely independent of any DIAA conference for its whole lifespan?
Hate that it came to this and I'm afraid there's no neat and tidy way to resolve this.
Hate that it came to this and I'm afraid there's no neat and tidy way to resolve this.
This Sallies injunction could set up for the realignment that got tabled years ago. Switch up these divisions and openings would occur. Wouldn’t help for this year but could change the future.
should have waited and planned for the condense second half of year solution. No way DIAA didn’t see this coming and if they didn’t they should all be fired.
should have waited and planned for the condense second half of year solution. No way DIAA didn’t see this coming and if they didn’t they should all be fired.
What is the process of being on DIAA board? Is there a term limit? After hearing some of the comments and listening to the meeting many of the board members should step down. I would hope they do not work in education but it would not surprise me.
I think they had 4 or 5 schedule them last year and this year(pre COVID)
I have heard there was some type of agreement that some BHC teams would play Sallies every year. Maybe they are hanging on to that.
Just can’t believe this is going on during a pandemic.
Sals had 5 games scheduled vs BHC teams for 2020
Sallies-
@ William Penn
@ Dover
Appo
Smyrna
@Episcopal Academy (PA)
Lansdale Catholic (PA)
St Georges
@HVT
@ Middletown
St Marks
I think they should move to a rotating basis like professional soccer - Size of School is 50% and the other 50% is off of the last 3 years winning % or something.
Or let them self select into D2 or D1 - so a school in D1 can choose to go down if they meet certain particpation or are below a threshold winning %. AKA Delcastle, Charter, etc.
Or let D2 that meet a certain winning % have the ability to request to play at D1 - Woodbridge, Delmar. etc
Would be better for everyone.
Or let them self select into D2 or D1 - so a school in D1 can choose to go down if they meet certain particpation or are below a threshold winning %. AKA Delcastle, Charter, etc.
Or let D2 that meet a certain winning % have the ability to request to play at D1 - Woodbridge, Delmar. etc
Would be better for everyone.
FOOTBALL TOURNAMENT Committee Members
Jim Comegys, Chair............. Colonial School District
Joseph Hemphill .................. St. Elizabeth High School, Retired
Tom MacLeish........................DFOA Official
Bob Barrish.............................NDFOA Official
George Kosanovich................Concord High School, Retired
Dan Ritter.................................Howard High School
Eric Torbert..............................Capital School District
Kevin Smith .............................Sussex Central High School, AD
Jody Russell............................. Newark High School
Matt Carre...............................McKean High School, AD
Dr. David Robinson ................Honorary Lifetime
Donna Polk...........................Ex-Officio, Executive Director, DIAA
Dr. Bradley Layfield. .........Ex-Officio, Chairperson, DIAA
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Thank you BiB,
Besides the unfairness and inequity against Sallies about the schedule. Not sure of the rules but I am assuming a majority of these members voted in favor of the number of games needed to qualify for playoffs, auto bids etc. How do you do this to high school kids?
Russell might be listed as a public member, but is the Newark HC
thanks corrected... Blue Hen Conference certainly holds the majority..
If you watched the meeting there was pretty much zero concern for Sallies or any of the privates for that matter to include the SPL teams.
Sals adds road games at Lansdale Catholic and Malvern Prep. 5 games now, which is the minimum considered for this year's football tournaments.
That is good that they have 5. Don’t know much about either school but I am sure BiB will give us the breakdown.
Sallies looks a mess here. They are asking for DIAA help and may take legal action. Myers writes another article today. Now they have 2 more games. Am I missing something here?
I was under the impression that they could not play OOS.
They just couldn't travel to New Jersey as NJ has DE on quarantine list was my understanding as well as teams probably won't want to come here and have to wear a mask while playing... Now just get a couple MIAA teams and bam.. done Would love to see a Salesianum vs Calvert Hall or Loyola game. I would travel to Md to watch and hang out with some old buddies of course..
As for LC and MP both will be tough but winnable games.. Same as playing Episcopal last couple years..
It is a numbers game and everyone playing and Sallies is losing out. Feel sorry for the Sallies kids but that is the unfortunate truth. I don't know if DIAA did or did not see this coming but Sallies surely should have. If it was 8 games that opens up BHC and Sallies would should easily be in the position to get a full schedule. As I said before what would they have done if it was 6 Games which was planned for the condensed season in March. They may not have had a game at all.
NBC News 10 ran the story this morning.. it's getting interesting. Sallies having to wear masks when they play OOS when their opponent won't be is bullshit. Actually the players having to wear masks on the field is bullshit. Only two states are requiring this Delaware and Michigan. What if a player chokes on it or is having a hard time breathing. Can't be good for an athlete wearing a mask that limits breathing to any extent...WTF?
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Crazy they're making these athletes wear masks, on top of wearing mouth guards! The next question is will the OOS state teams give the Delaware teams the mandatory "breathing break" ?
That's another good question regarding mouth guards. How is the ref supposed to make sure the players are putting there guards in or using one at all? The whole thing with wearing masks during play is a dumb idea..
Mandatory break is only when there is 20 minutes of continuous play which should only affect soccer. According to SMAC that was based upon "military medical research" of O2 levels while doing physical activity while wearing mask. Which is why soccer is moving to (3) 20 min periods.
Field hockey changed to 15-minute periods to avoid unnatural breaks. Soccer will play four 20-minute periods for a regular 80-minute game.
I have been thinking about the Sallies situation. I feel for the kids. It is definitely not right. Everybody I talk to says the situation is not fair nor equitable. It is a fairly easy situation to rectify. I have heard of several ideas that would work. Some on this very board. But nothing gets done. WHY?
The old saying, "Follow the Money" does not pertain to this situation. But who will benefit the most, might. I am in the process of connecting the dots. I have an answer. It may not be right, but I think I am heading in the right direction.
Thanks BiB for the football tournament committee members. First State, thank you for the information on the public member of the committee. As I understand this is the committee that gave the recommendations to DIAA for the playoff scenario. Here are some interesting things about this committee.
1. The committee has a public member that is a football coach in blue hen flight B. Is the committee supposed to have a public member that is actually a public member?
2. The committee has 3 blue hen flight B members, more than any other conference.
3. I do not see any non conference members who are not retired.
4. I do not see any henny south members
5. The 3 flight B members are football coaches at their school, but listed as AD or public member
6. This is the committee that gave their recommendation to DIAA for auto bids, points for wins, and minimum games to qualify for playoffs
Which conference had the most to lose for the playoff spots? The answer is BHC Flight B. Since they boxed themselves into only playing a conference schedule, thus only playing 4 point opponents. The Diamond state member who gets 6 points for Charter and the other nonconference teams have scheduled 6 point teams. A clear threat to BHC playoff chances. At the time of the committee meeting, TH and Friends only had 3 games. By putting the number at 5, it eliminated those two. They had to stack the deck in their favor which made it unequitable for everyone else in a non conference including Sallies. How do you stack the deck? By having 3 members in flight B voting.
The members of the football flight B are Dan Ritter, Matt Carre, and Jody Russell. I do not know them, but I am sure there are connections between them.
So I ask, how is it fair and equitable to have a committee vote on a playoff format for everyone that in itself is not a fair and equitable representation of Delaware High School Football?
The old saying, "Follow the Money" does not pertain to this situation. But who will benefit the most, might. I am in the process of connecting the dots. I have an answer. It may not be right, but I think I am heading in the right direction.
Thanks BiB for the football tournament committee members. First State, thank you for the information on the public member of the committee. As I understand this is the committee that gave the recommendations to DIAA for the playoff scenario. Here are some interesting things about this committee.
1. The committee has a public member that is a football coach in blue hen flight B. Is the committee supposed to have a public member that is actually a public member?
2. The committee has 3 blue hen flight B members, more than any other conference.
3. I do not see any non conference members who are not retired.
4. I do not see any henny south members
5. The 3 flight B members are football coaches at their school, but listed as AD or public member
6. This is the committee that gave their recommendation to DIAA for auto bids, points for wins, and minimum games to qualify for playoffs
Which conference had the most to lose for the playoff spots? The answer is BHC Flight B. Since they boxed themselves into only playing a conference schedule, thus only playing 4 point opponents. The Diamond state member who gets 6 points for Charter and the other nonconference teams have scheduled 6 point teams. A clear threat to BHC playoff chances. At the time of the committee meeting, TH and Friends only had 3 games. By putting the number at 5, it eliminated those two. They had to stack the deck in their favor which made it unequitable for everyone else in a non conference including Sallies. How do you stack the deck? By having 3 members in flight B voting.
The members of the football flight B are Dan Ritter, Matt Carre, and Jody Russell. I do not know them, but I am sure there are connections between them.
So I ask, how is it fair and equitable to have a committee vote on a playoff format for everyone that in itself is not a fair and equitable representation of Delaware High School Football?
I’m now at a place that believes fall sports should not be competing for state championships. Not every school is equal in this situation for many reasons (no matter the sport). Fall sports athletes , coaches and admin have been thrown in (at the last minute) as the Guinea pigs for getting back to normal times in DE schools. Also, Almost all other winter and spring athletes couldn’t compete for state titles in 2020. Last but not least we should all just be happy just to see these kids be allowed play the games they love. Fall sports state championships and conference championships should be the least of anyone’s worries
I am inclined to agree with you..The championships will kind of come with an asterix anyway with shortened seasons and strange rules.. For football I like the 8 game season and bowl games idea..just for this year
How about this idea.. Do bowl games and give title sponsorship of the games to local business who have been hurt by the pandemic and give them some free pub and advertising. The local printers could pitch in and make up some nice programs for the games with the proceeds from sales of those going to help victims of the pandemic... eh eh ? rut roe the BiB is thinking outside the box again.. 🤔
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To go even further with this Bowl game idea and make it fun.. Use the MAX/CALPREPS computer ratings to set the games... 1v2 3v4 5v6 and so on.. Use the best venues in the state available and do a Friday Night game and 3 to 4 games on Sat and Sunday at those venues.. How about a day of bowl games at the AB? That would get some serious pub.. I think this would be fun and scratch that competitive itch for the players and coaches.. The race for #1 DELHS Pandemic Bowls 2020
Wow, I think that may be even worse, so no break until the end of the quarters?
This is a DIAA mandate, not a state mandate correct?
Your points make total sense, particularly regarding Flight B, but if Ritter, Carre and Russell were trying to look out for their conference, they didn't do so well. Flight B basically has no way to earn an at-large. In addition to Caravel playing 2 Division I teams, Tower Hill has Charter and Polytech among its 5. And everyone in the Henny South has a Division I game, as does the Diamond State. So even an undefeated Flight B team might be on the outside looking in.
There are a few reasons why this will not happen. One, the mindset among the DIAA board from the moment they approved the fall restart was that if one sport decided not to hold a tournament, none would. Presumably for the entire year in every sport. There was little appetite for that. Second, the football committee wouldn't even consider changes to its qualifying criteria. That tournament was going to happen, with the same format, as it normally does.
Correct. Maybe I misread it. Perhaps they were looking to guarantee at least one Flight B team and didn't even think of anyone else's chances of getting in.
but you bring up another point of contention.. Looks like Tower Hill is just going with 5 games and looking to point index in with the two D1 puffs. Hopefully Friends and St Marks beats them.. Caravels schedule is tough I don't see them getting in with what they lost.. Pretty sure Hen South will get their 1 auto and another. Flight B with their 1. So too me there is just one spot for a DSC, Indy, or CA and in my estimation that team will have to be undefeated or have a 4.0 index
Quick Math
TH goes 5-0 .. 6+6+4+4+4= 24 div by 5 = 4.8 index ( even if they drop one to Friends or St M 4.0 index which is an undefeated season vs all D2's)
vs a DSC that goes 7-0 (with charter) 4+4+4+4+4+4+6 = 30 div by 7 = 4.29 index
vs a Hen South team with 1 D1 same as DSC outcome
Bottom line TH having two D1 puffs is a huge advantage...
As for minimum games to qualify.
The regular rule is 8 of 10 80% 5 of 7 is 72% 6 of 7 is 86%
The minimum number of games to qualify absolutely should have been 6
Quick Math
TH goes 5-0 .. 6+6+4+4+4= 24 div by 5 = 4.8 index ( even if they drop one to Friends or St M 4.0 index which is an undefeated season vs all D2's)
vs a DSC that goes 7-0 (with charter) 4+4+4+4+4+4+6 = 30 div by 7 = 4.29 index
vs a Hen South team with 1 D1 same as DSC outcome
Bottom line TH having two D1 puffs is a huge advantage...
As for minimum games to qualify.
The regular rule is 8 of 10 80% 5 of 7 is 72% 6 of 7 is 86%
The minimum number of games to qualify absolutely should have been 6
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Tower Hill really should be ashamed of themselves with the cupcake scheduling and they do it EVERY year.
That said, the artist formerly known as GatekeeperRefugee has an idea that DIAA/the football committee could've discussed weeks ago and avoided all of this:
For one season only, a true state tournament. 16 teams, by record/point index/strength of schedule, 1st round/quarterfinals/semifinals/finals. One champion.
That said, the artist formerly known as GatekeeperRefugee has an idea that DIAA/the football committee could've discussed weeks ago and avoided all of this:
For one season only, a true state tournament. 16 teams, by record/point index/strength of schedule, 1st round/quarterfinals/semifinals/finals. One champion.
BIB - nice that you can handle the big math before lunchtime
Are bonus points available this season?
I think they probably erred on the side of caution using 5 out of 7 just because the higher potential of games being cancelled due to Covid
Are bonus points available this season?
I think they probably erred on the side of caution using 5 out of 7 just because the higher potential of games being cancelled due to Covid
Looking at the South.. I will predict WB goes undefeated and DM just loses to WB. Delmar has 2 D1's on schedule so if they can beat CR they will be looking pretty whether they beat WB or not..
WB- 7-0 w 1 D1 win : 30 or 4.29
DM 6-1 w 2 D1 wins : 28 or 4.00
( if DM beats WB WB not in as good of shape at 6-1 or 3.43)
plus I believe both these two teams will get at least 3 bonus points..
SO.. I am thinking it will take a 4.0 or better to get into D2 tourney
WB- 7-0 w 1 D1 win : 30 or 4.29
DM 6-1 w 2 D1 wins : 28 or 4.00
( if DM beats WB WB not in as good of shape at 6-1 or 3.43)
plus I believe both these two teams will get at least 3 bonus points..
SO.. I am thinking it will take a 4.0 or better to get into D2 tourney
BIB - nice that you can handle the big math before lunchtime
Are bonus points available this season?
I think they probably erred on the side of caution using 5 out of 7 just because the higher potential of games being cancelled due to Covid
yes on bonus points... 1 pt for playing a 5 win team plus another if they win 6 or better
also the Covid cancelations do count as games played. They are either a fft win for one team or a tie if both can't play.
Yes a D2 team can get 6 pts for FFT win if they have a D1 scheduled and the D1 cant play due to Covid
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