still early....but

[baseballisboring]

Still early in the year, but anyone care to share their thoughts on how this season is going to shape up? Can anyone in the state compete with sallies?

 

[laxkeep98]

Unfortunately, highly unlikely. Maybe someone can go Red Lion on them with their offseason practices, but that will never happen. Even if some things they do are unfair to other delaware teams such as tournaments, scrimmages, and out of state games, they are what sallies needs to be a national contender. I hope that one day they will leave DIAA so they can add more out of state games and further become a nationally recognized team. I think that would also be better for other teams across Delaware so that they don't have to compete for 2nd place in the state rankings and tournament. I feel bad for a very talented senior class with kids from Tower Hill, Friends, St. Marks, and Archmere that just don't have the depth/role players to make such an upset over Sallies likely.

Now don't get me wrong, they are beatable. They lose their best attackman over the last two years, one of the best defenders ever to play in Delaware, and one of the best faceoff guys in the nation. They lost their starting goalie, but in my opinion he wasn't all that great, and they get the goalie from Appo in return so they may benefit from that.

The fact that they lost their faceoff guy really changes their team dynamic. Now other teams will be able to actually see some of the ball. But they still have to somehow stop a motion offense with Giampietro, Reeder, Kelly, and others. Oh and teams may have a better chance of penetrating the defense, but that will still be a tremendous challenge, especially with the out of state experience that they will acquire.

Last year I'd say a top 5 team had a 5% chance of beating the Sals. This year, I'd say its a 15-20% chance.

 

[baseballisboring]

md
This post was edited on 3/26 7:53 AM by baseballisboring

 

[Jule2211]

Firs of all what sallies is doing is not against the staights rules, going to out of state team tournaments and showcases is not against the rules. Salesianum usually ony goes to 1 team tournament in the fall and one in the winter, this is not illegal tower hill, archmere, and friends do the same thing. Alot of these kids also go to individual showcases and team ones with thier club teams this is just the nature of the game just because these families have more income to pay for these tournaments does not mean they should be punished. Get your facts straight about how the program is run before you speak. Second I couldnt see the state moving to a division 1 division 2 lacross tournament style due to two things. First of all the state is too small and would lead to a less competitive off season and second even though the state is still small many schools dont even have lacross teams especially down southe maybe if lacrosse expanded in the state than they migh but as it is now thier will only be one division.

 

[laxkeep98]

I'm sorry for any misunderstanding. I never meant that anything that they did was against the rules. And sure other top teams also do what Sallies does in the offseason, but not nearly to that degree. For example, Salesianum plays in a fall league up in Pennsylvania. Good for them it provides them with experience against very talented teams. Theres nothing wrong with that. But teams like Archmere, Tower Hill, Friends, Cape, and St. Marks can't necessarily do that because the majority of their players are participating in fall and winter sports. In fact, some of those schools require their students to participate in multiple sports just so they can fill their rosters. What I'm trying to say is the talent gap will continue to widen. And no, the d1 d2 system won't be effective because frankly there isn't enough talent within the state to go around. As I said before, what Sallies is doing is great for them on a national scale, but it's a shame to see everyone else to have to settle for second place at best.



Please approach these subjects with an open mind before you attack me like that. I personally know many of the fathers of Salesianum players, and I know and appreciate how their program is run.

 

[biglaxfan]

Salesianum has definitely elevated the level of play in Delaware. They will be a dominant force in Delaware high school lax for many years. To think that other Delaware schools will not or can not make the adjustment is not realistic. The top Delaware coaches will create and maintain competitive programs now that Sallies has shown them they have to do it. It just may take them a few years to catch up.

 

[outside view]

Continuing this thread, anyone care to share how they think things will go this year? Sallies is strong as usual, who are the next teams with a shot to knock them off? Hearing that Cape and Tower Hill may have the kids coming back to beat the Sals, or at least push them, any other thoughts?

 

[Sportsmrty7]

Tatnall just hired Bill Madison away from DMA. Great coach. Look for a resurgent Hornets squad over the next several seasons.

 

[EBCendofthebenchclub]

Is this confirmed?

 

[Sportsmrty7]

If you're referring to Bill Madison, yes. He's already listed as the coach on Tatnall's site.

 

[EBCendofthebenchclub]

Just saw an email about this. Thanks for the update.
This post was edited on 1/24 8:40 AM by EBCendofthebenchclub

 

[laxkeep98]

In my opinion, the only teams with any chance of beating Sallies are C.R., St. Marks, and Cape. Tower Hill, Archmere, and Friends lost a lot, and frankly they weren't competitive enough for Sallies before. St. Marks had a decent end of the year last year, nearly knocking off Archmere. They were led by a lot of Sophmores and Juniors that have now taken another year to mature and develop. C.R. lost their best attackman and midfielder. I'm not sure what they lost defensively, but they keep a solid core of players. The majority of Cape's starters last year were Sophmores so they will also benefit from the years of experience. They return Luke Benson and their attack other along with a decent defense and goalie. They did lose to all-staters at midfield.

I would rank the teams as follows. And I'm really hesitant to seperate 2nd through 4th ranked teams before seeing how they play this year, but it's the best I can do. The spaces between teams represent the differences in quality. A.K.A. bigger space=bigger gap.

1. Sallies



2. C.R.
3. Cape
4. St. Mark's


5. Friend's

6. Archmere
7. Tower Hill

 

[laxdeusa]

I agree Sallies will be tough for the in state teams to beat. Has anyone seen the Sals schedule for this year? The 6 schools you mention here plus Middletown. And a brutal out of state schedule that includes some of the best teams in the country including the number one team from California.

 

[laxkeep98]

Here's a link
http://www.salliessports.com/Page9734.aspx

 

[outside view]

Wow, if the Sallies can beat the teams on their schedule it could really mean a lot for Delaware lacrosse. Seems like a good thing for Delaware, but if no one else in Delaware can beat them, or even come close, what does that mean for DE Lax?
Do they have a shot to beat those teams, I don't know much about the teams on the schedule?

 

[sportsfann51]

it's all relative.. Sallies got beat by Calvert Hall last year by 7 goals . They had a running clock against most of the local teams on the sheet last year... bottom line is the the smaller privates in DE (300 kids of less) can't field a team with enough talent or depth to play with them (Sallies = over 1000 boys).. Some of the privates are having trouble fielding JV teams at all.

I wish them luck with their expanded schedule...they should play more and more games outside of DE. I wonder why Middletown is still on their schedule??

 

[outside view]

Not sure I see your point; Sallies loses by 7 goals to the #1 team in the country and the DE teams are killed in every game? I understand your point about the small private schools in terms of # of potential players, but I believe Tower Hill and Tatnall used to be the best teams, even with Sallies 1000 boys at the time. Being new to this, what's changed? And my last question is why, with their extremely large sizes are CR, Cape and Middletown not competitive with Sallies - football they not only compete but beat "the 1000 boys"?

 

[laxkeep98]

In my opinion, it comes from the out of state schedule. The games they play with teams like Calvert Hall, Malvern Prep, etc. are all played at a much higher tempo than what is experienced here in Delaware. Other teams across Delaware see nothing close to the speed that Sallies is accustomed to, until they play them of course.

 

[Jule2211]

Ew @outside view, dude don't you ever, ever compare football and lacrosse ever again. They are two different sports where you have to be a total all around in shape athlete, football you can be fat and strong and be good at football. Lacrosse takes coordination speed, strength and agility. Theres no way you can compare them so dont even try, you are very wrong the size of the school has led salesianum to be a powerhouse in all sports thats why it wins the most state championships out of any DE school every year if you deny this you are an idiot. And the reason they play middletown is becaus Heally hates the program their for some reason and like to embarass people that disrespect the salesianum program. Anyone else think though that delaware lacrosse is not getting as much respect as it deserves? As seen in salesianums schedule they will take on La costa canyon for california which has been ranked many times yet they usually play a very week in state schedule and only a few out of state games that they usually lose as well as sometimes losing 1 or two instate games a season yet they are continously ranked. Also in looking at Tower hill who beat shipley school (pa) by 7 points but shipley school almost beat lake highland prep on a road game all the way in florida and lost in overtime. Yet they are the ones with higher ranks than tower hill or salesianum, my question is why are analyst keep giving recognition to states like california florida and georgia and not looking at states like delaware, maine, rhode island, ohio, and indiana where teams are getting better and are actually able to beat traditional hotbed teams. im tired of all this florida and calfornia hype in my opinion these are not starting points for new hotbeds and do not breed better lacross players, I think programs there are a joke and many teams from the other states i mentioned who defeat thier most top tier teams, does anyone else agree?

 

[outside view]

Jule2211;
1. Football vs. Lacrosse (see Jim Brown); I was not comparing the sports, just asking about the argument that Sallies is only good at lacrosse because they have "1000 boys". Or are you saying that the Sallies boys ALL have more "coordination speed, strength and agility" than the other schools listed here, that they're just better athletes?
Below are approximate number of enrolled students for some of the large schools in DE per Wikepedia;
Sallies - 1100 boys
CR - 2200 students = approx. 1100 boys
Cape - 1222 students = approx. 610 boys
St Marks - 1500 students = approx. 750 boys
Concord - 1353 students = approx. 676 boys
Middletown - 1222 students = approx. 610 boys
Sussex Tec - 1309 students = approx. 650 boys
A I DuPont - 1481 students = approx. 740 boys
Independent Schools per Sportsfan, less than 300 boys
By the "1000 boys" lacrosse argument the championship should always be either Salesianum or CR. In fact, Tower Hill, Friends, and Archmere should never be competitive and yet year in and year out these 3 are consistently playing in the semi-finals for the state championship!
Guess that's why they play the game. No, not an idiot, just asking a question when looking at the numbers.

2. Here is a partial list of DE State Lacrosse Champions;
'05 Tower Hill
'06 Cape
'07 Sallies
'08 Cape
'09 Sallies
'10 Tower Hill
'11 Sallies
'12 Sallies
I was only asking if anyone knew what the change was in the last few years that made Sallies so much stronger than the other teams. I believe Laxkeep has answered my question; one reason may be Sallies' ramped up schedule may simply be better developing players and when facing some of the best teams out of state the team may be better prepared to play the instate teams.

3. I do agree that the state appears to get little respect. Looking at the Laxpower formula for computing the rankings, the strength of schedule may be the problem, many instate teams are rated very low....I agree DE teams can compete with the out of state teams - Sallies beating some of the out of state teams may get more respect for DE this year.

 

[laxer3416]

i dont think that just looking at enrollment is a good indicator of the strength of a program. think about the types of kids that would attend sallies...kids with strong academics and a supportive family that has an interest in athletics. so you primarily have an entire school full of the types of kids that come in with everything they need to succeed. a public school has to take any student that lives in its area. kids attend sallies bc its a great school and they want to be a part of their successful athletic programs. therefore sallies builds itself on its reputation. trust me the 1100 or so boys that attend sallies are not the same types of 1000s or 100s of boys that attend a public school. having said all that, regardless of where they come from, they deserve everything they get because hard work is hard work from the coaches and the players.

 

[MightyMik]

One big reason is Coach Healy. And if anyone does see why than they are clueless. Look at Sallies record before Healy and see what he has done in his time there. Scheduling also plays apart in it too. Better competition gets them ready for state competition. Lacrosse players want to go there and that includes multiple state players coming to play for one of the best coaches around.

As far as the comment that Sallies win the most championships year in year out clearly you are not talking about major sports. Okay they got soccer down, cross country, swimming. That's what they won last year. They wouldn't even count as major sports so I think your agruement is bad

 

[sportsfann51]

OK...so maybe I should have said "type" of boys (and having enrollment of 1100 should give you room for alot of good lax players to choose from) that attend Sallies and intend to play lax. Good lacrosse players go there because it's a good program with good coaching , good results etc.

Other schools.... kids go the the school and play lacrosse.. Sallies...they go there to play.

the fact that other schools have won a title proves that you still have to play the game...

 

[OnehandedCzech]

Sallies play Middletown because of the strong youth league in Middletown. They will either add Appo or replace Middletown with Appo eventually.

They don't destroy Middletown because Healy hates them either. What are you 12? Healy is a grown man and respected coach, he doesn't need to embarrass teams "because he doesn't like them".

They lay it on Middletown because they can and because they want to get the attention of all of the talented kids coming out of the mIddletown youth program.

That's why their goalie is there now. Sallies wants to have a presence in every community with a feeder program that has procduced any kind of talent.

 

[laxkeep98]

They have always been dominant in a majority of sports. No, their teams haven't always won championships but they do manage to make deep postseason runs the vast majority of the time in almost every sport.

The lacrosse team has had a decade of dominance, but up until last year, they were a beatable team. In recent years, Tower Hill won the state championship and also came within two the year after. They also managed to play them respectably in the regular season games of the past few years up until the 2012 season. The same can be said for Cape, who played them well in 2010 and 2011, along with Archmere who played them well in 2011. So of course they were dominant but there was still a decent chance that they could be beat. In the past year, and most likely this year, they have been/are nearly unbeatable. Some of this is the drop off of programs like Tower Hill, Archmere, Tatnall, Friends, St. Marks and Cape (although St. Marks Cape will likely be on upswings this year). But the rest of it is the tempo that the accomodate to in these rigorous out of state games. They showed tremendous improvement over the course of last year with strong, competitive games that prepared them well come tournament time. I'm not trying to argue that the out of state games are the only factor, but I think that it is definitely a primary cause for their dominance. And yes, Healy deserves a ton of credit. I'm sorry to leave him out in my prior post.

 

[Alaxer46]

Coach Healy and his coaching staff have completely transformed Sallies into a lacrosse powerhouse. His success has only drawn more and more talented players from the area. As long as he is at Sallies, I don't think they will have a year where they don't make the semi-finals - huge upsets are always possible as Tower Hill showed a few years ago in the championship. I could see Healy making the jump to the college level, but that's purely speculation.
While Healy is a terrific coach, you also have to look at the talent he's had on his teams - Sallies has had 2 or 3 All Americans every year since 2007. Great coaching and great players win championships.

 

[panther2superbee]

I always thought good teams beat good players..And defence wins championships..I'm sure Coach Healy would agree..
Sure Sallies has a fine program for the DE. competition but until they beat some of the teams from the MIAA I don't think we can start talking National power..

 

[Coach Joe73]

Coach Healy...

Look at them before Healy and after Healy...

I have seen them up close and WOW.... Well oiled machine.. Disciplined, tough, mean, gritty, focused.... yeah they have talent but they also take on their head coach and his demeanor. He has his print ALL over that team.

You just do not stumble upon 4 state championships in 6 years guys.... They are well, well coached!!!