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Games today - Thursday May 12

oldskool42

In the weight room getting big
Apr 30, 2012
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St Georges (11-2) vs Appo (13-3) at FRAWLEY. St G has won 10 of their last 11 and has won the Flight B championship, so their ticket is punched for the tourney. St G hasn’t had the toughest competition thus far with only 2 games against the other top ten teams (win vs mtwn & loss to Sals) and only 1 other game against what I would call a playoff caliber team. St G is led on the mound by Campbell and Gilbert, but both have pitched over the past two days and wont be available. St G has Conrad to play on Saturday (assuming the game gets in due to weather) so they could have a tough time this week . Appo has won 11 of its last 12 and shouldn’t have any trouble getting into the tourney. Its all about seeding at this point. Appo finishes the season with St g today and Cape on Monday. Appo has had a little tougher competition with 4 games against top ten teams but they lost 3 (Smy, Sals, Mtown) but did beat #1 team St Marks. Appo has been getting decent pitching this year from Steckline and Stamper allowing only 3 runs per game. They are putting up almost 8 runs per game. Garrett threw 3 on Monday, Stamper threw 5 on Tuesday and Steckline did throw 1 also on Tuesday. So pitching matchups could be interesting.

Tech (9-7) @ Smryna (12-2). Tech had made a big comeback from its 2-4 start by winning 7 straight games, but they have dropped three straight lately to St Marks, Cape & Poly. Tech has Smyrna today and Lake on Monday….so things aren’t going to finish easy. Tech is fighting for its tourney life. They should get lots of bonus points, but two losses to finish could make it very hairy on the playoff bubble. One win in their last two would go a long way to ensure a playoff spot. Smyrna is up two games in their conference but do have four conference games left to end the season (Tech, CR, Poly & Cape). Smyrna certainly doesn’t finish easy either, but are pretty much a lock for the playoffs regardless of their finish. Smyrna has won six straight including wins over St Marks, Lake, Milford and central. They also beat Dover and Appo this year. Their only losses were to Caravel and Mtown. Smyrna has gotten great pitching from Carrow and Barkley this year and can hit the ball well. Tech won last year 2-1.

Dover (14-2) @ Milford (8-6). Dover is certainly in the playoffs and could have an outside shot for the conference title should Smyrna fall apart. Dover has won 8 games straight and has gotten great pitching from Lawson and Hutchins. Milford is fighting for its playoff life. They should get in given they have Wood and IR still to play along with Dover and St Marks. They also are only a half game back from Lake (whom they beat already). Milford had won 3 straight before getting smashed by Smyrna 12-2. Dover won this matchup last year 4-3 in a 12 inning barn burner.

Poly @ Delmar. Both these teams are fighting to get into the tourney. Poly at 10-3 should get in especially with winnable games against Seaford, DEPSS and Christiana left on their schedule. They do have an outside shot at the conference title even though they are 2 back to Smyrna and they play each other next week. Delmar at 8-7 is on the bubble. They play Poly, Central and Seaford so they have a shot with a win or two to stay in the discussion especially with bonus pts. All three games are winnable games and they are only a game and a half back in their conference.

Lake @ Cape. Lake had been cruising along with 9 straight wins, but they have lost 2 of their last 3 to Smyrna and CR (1-0). At 10-5 and a half game lead in their conference, they probably have done enough to get in the tourney. But they play Cape, Tech and Sallies to finish things out. Cape was rolling along playing well but then got skunked by Dover 10-0 a couple weeks ago. Then they came out last week and dropped a game to previously winless Seaford. They did rebound with a 7-3 win over Tech on Monday to right the ship and a nice game over IR. Now things get ugly because they finish the season with Lake, St Marks, Sallies (makeup down 3-1 in 7th inning), Appo and Smyrna. They could very easily play well but lose the rest of their games. They also have an outside shot at the conference title if they beat Smyrna and get some help. They probably have done enough to get in the tourney anyway.

Conrad @ Arch. Big conference rivalry. Conrad beat them earlier in the season 3-1 at Frawley scoring 2 in the bottom of the fifth to break a tie. Conrad’s pitching has been very good as has their hitting. They have won 6 straight since their drubbing by St Marks 13-3. Their only other blemish this season was a 4-3 loss to St E. Conrad hasn’t had the toughest schedule with only 1 game against top ten teams (St Marks game). Their only other playoff caliber competition was two wins over DMA and the prior victory over Archmere. Archmere has had a similar schedule with not as good results overall. Arch lost to DMA, lost to Wilm Christian and lost to Concord???. Arch did play a more competitive game with St Marks than Conrad did (if that means anything to you).

Newark @ Sallies. Newark didn’t have a lot of expectations this year but have compiled a nice 8-8 record. They finish the season with Sallies and Glasgow. I’m not sure if they did enough to get in, but they will be in the discussion, especially if they get a win and certainly 2 wins. Newark got wins over Tech and St E this year. They played Appo and Mtown really tough in close losses but got smoked by Smyrna, DMA. Their close loss to Mt P might hurt them and how they got smoked by Wm Penn 13-1 is beyond me. Sallies seemingly is losing steam to finish the season. They have lost 2 straight and 5 of their last 8 games. They aren’t playing bad, but they aren’t winning games. They lost by 2 to ST Marks last week and beat St E 5-3. But they got shutout by Tech 5-0 and lost to Central the week before that. Now this week they get shocked by a below par Charter team 2-1. Sallies has Newark and IR next to figure it out before they finish the season with Cape, St E and Lake. I would think from bonus points alone they should easily get in unless the wheels fall off and they lose out.
 
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Cape will play Smyrna for the Henlopen North title on Tuesday , Cape with 1 loss in the north to Dover and Smyrna with zero losses
 
great game tonight in Smyrna against S Tech. It went 9 innings with both squads starting pitchers pitching a gem. J Carrow of Smyrna threw 8 strong innings and Justin Hill of S Tech went the distance throwing 9 strong innings and only allowing 5 hits. Smyrna won 3-2
 
Tech threw Justin hill 121 pitches tonight , he also threw 1ip on Monday and 1ip Tuesday with getting lose and pre inning warming up that's prob over 200 pitches since Monday , somebody should be ashamed of themselves doing that to him
 
urbaseballdaddy..... you've caused me to dive in this morning and get to the bottom of this. I spoke with some parents who were at the game and never once did I hear J Hill was laboring or acted as if he wanted to be taken out. In fact, most said he appeared to be getting stronger in the later innings. I am never a fan of abusing a pitchers arm but I don't believe this is the case. I would hope no Coach in High School would put a game first and player second. So, instead of bashing the coach I believe we should praise the High School Senior who in his final games and fighting for a playoff spot showed great leadership and put the team on his back. That's the information I gathered this morning.
 
Need to be careful when judging others and their programs. With that being said, 221 pitches in 4 games over six days certainly seems like A LOT of pitches!
 
urbaseballdaddy..... you've caused me to dive in this morning and get to the bottom of this. I spoke with some parents who were at the game and never once did I hear J Hill was laboring or acted as if he wanted to be taken out. In fact, most said he appeared to be getting stronger in the later innings. I am never a fan of abusing a pitchers arm but I don't believe this is the case. I would hope no Coach in High School would put a game first and player second. So, instead of bashing the coach I believe we should praise the High School Senior who in his final games and fighting for a playoff spot showed great leadership and put the team on his back. That's the information I gathered this morning.


Of course the info will be bias I'm just saying that should never happen in my opinion , I'm all for kids stepping up and trying to will their team to victory , the Hill family are great people I personally know them well , my concern is for the player , also didn't mention he threw Saturday as well so that's over 300 pitches from the mound in 6 days , not one person can think that's acceptable
 
Need to be careful when judging others and their programs. With that being said, 221 pitches in 4 games over six days certainly seems like A LOT of pitches!


I'm not judging I'm stating my opinion which is 228 pitches since Saturday with getting loose on the side and then 14ip with 4-5 warm ups in between innings is 300+ throws from the mound and did we forget when he's not pitching he's usually plays SS
 
great game tonight in Smyrna against S Tech. It went 9 innings with both squads starting pitchers pitching a gem. J Carrow of Smyrna threw 8 strong innings and Justin Hill of S Tech went the distance throwing 9 strong innings and only allowing 5 hits. Smyrna won 3-2

Went to SG - Appo game at Frawley. Appo wins it 4-1. All the runs in first 2 innings. Not much hitting. Starter from SG had control problems. Reliever shut Appo down over last 4 innings. Also SG committed 5 errors.

Highlight was diving play by Appo 2B. Ranged far to left and full out to make play. Got up and had runner by couple steps.
 
urbaseballdaddy..... you've caused me to dive in this morning and get to the bottom of this. I spoke with some parents who were at the game and never once did I hear J Hill was laboring or acted as if he wanted to be taken out. In fact, most said he appeared to be getting stronger in the later innings. I am never a fan of abusing a pitchers arm but I don't believe this is the case. I would hope no Coach in High School would put a game first and player second. So, instead of bashing the coach I believe we should praise the High School Senior who in his final games and fighting for a playoff spot showed great leadership and put the team on his back. That's the information I gathered this morning.
there is no reason for throwing 300 pitches in 6 days no matter how good the kid feels .Its a coaches responsibility to make sure these things don't happen that's why we ended up with an 85 pitch limit early part of season. if he threw that many pitches in 6 days how many has he thrown up till now and still has all of travel ball to go or club ball if hes going to college .high school baseball is not that important to have a kid risk injury .Yes this is a case where the coach did the wrong thing.
 
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I agree it seems like a lot of pitches but just using the little league concept on protecting arms. A kid can throw 20 with no rest. 40 with a days rest and 95 in a start. That is 175 in that time period alone so as outrageous as the total sounds it is within the scientific measures
 
This is one of my "favorite" discussions every year.

Why do people think that because a kid "looks fine"....then he must be fine.

Is looking fine a good indicator of arm health? So if someone throws 500 pitches and "looks fine" and is still throwing strikes then he should keep pitching? I think everyone would agree that 500 pitches is ridiculous. So whats the number? Is it 50, 150 or 500? Oh wait, lets let some high school baseball coach / gym teacher watch the kid closely to determine when a kid has had it. Oh wait, he is a good coach. Surely he knows. Oh wait...he has been coaching a long time. Ohhhhhhh,

The pitching rules are in place because people SHOULDN'T trust the coaches, parents or the kids themselves. Everyone is caught up in the emotions of the game to make good decisions.

You can get experts to argue both sides which amazes me. But i think everyone would agree that an overused pitching arm is not a good thing. More and more we are seeing kids needing surgery. Of course an injury can happen on pitch #1 or pitch#150. You just never know. So there is no MAGIC number. But when an arm is overused your increasing the chances of an injury happening immediately OR over time. The scary thing about it is that a kid can easily pitch 200 pitches but have no signs of a problem. Not even an ortho dr giving the kid an mri after every inning could detect an issue developing because of overuse. (but i'm sure a coach could haha). But is the kid icing down....resting. etc etc. Even if the kid is doing everything perfectly...an injury can occur out of the blue or from overuse.

Perfectly trained major league pitchers have limits. WHy? Not because they can't throw 200 pitches...but because teams and experts feel that pitching too much COULD increase the chance for injury and/or limit their useful years pitching. So they are conservative and careful thinking of the longterm plan. I'm thinking that the same thought process would be appropriate for a young, developing arm as well.

So what do we do? We have reasonable, conservative limits. What is the worse case scenerio if you take a kid out at lets say 100 pitches and he could have gone more. There is no harm in taking a kid out. But what could happen...you might not win the game. Oh....thats where we come back to. Nobody wants to take a kid out thats pitching really well.

Now back to the pitches...221 pitches from Saturday to Thursday seems like a lot but i'm more concerned with throwing in live games 4 days over a 6 day period. Thats a lot. Especially when you look at the last day in that cycle being an extraordinary load of 121 pitches.
 
This is one of my "favorite" discussions every year.

Why do people think that because a kid "looks fine"....then he must be fine.

Is looking fine a good indicator of arm health? So if someone throws 500 pitches and "looks fine" and is still throwing strikes then he should keep pitching? I think everyone would agree that 500 pitches is ridiculous. So whats the number? Is it 50, 150 or 500? Oh wait, lets let some high school baseball coach / gym teacher watch the kid closely to determine when a kid has had it. Oh wait, he is a good coach. Surely he knows. Oh wait...he has been coaching a long time. Ohhhhhhh,

The pitching rules are in place because people SHOULDN'T trust the coaches, parents or the kids themselves. Everyone is caught up in the emotions of the game to make good decisions.

You can get experts to argue both sides which amazes me. But i think everyone would agree that an overused pitching arm is not a good thing. More and more we are seeing kids needing surgery. Of course an injury can happen on pitch #1 or pitch#150. You just never know. So there is no MAGIC number. But when an arm is overused your increasing the chances of an injury happening immediately OR over time. The scary thing about it is that a kid can easily pitch 200 pitches but have no signs of a problem. Not even an ortho dr giving the kid an mri after every inning could detect an issue developing because of overuse. (but i'm sure a coach could haha). But is the kid icing down....resting. etc etc. Even if the kid is doing everything perfectly...an injury can occur out of the blue or from overuse.

Perfectly trained major league pitchers have limits. WHy? Not because they can't throw 200 pitches...but because teams and experts feel that pitching too much COULD increase the chance for injury and/or limit their useful years pitching. So they are conservative and careful thinking of the longterm plan. I'm thinking that the same thought process would be appropriate for a young, developing arm as well.

So what do we do? We have reasonable, conservative limits. What is the worse case scenerio if you take a kid out at lets say 100 pitches and he could have gone more. There is no harm in taking a kid out. But what could happen...you might not win the game. Oh....thats where we come back to. Nobody wants to take a kid out thats pitching really well.

Now back to the pitches...221 pitches from Saturday to Thursday seems like a lot but i'm more concerned with throwing in live games 4 days over a 6 day period. Thats a lot. Especially when you look at the last day in that cycle being an extraordinary load of 121 pitches.


Finally some common sense brought to he discussion
 
@old..
there are a lot of fine doctors out there that can fix Little Johnny's arm...
let him throw!
hahahaha
 
Years ago I watched a father let his 8 yr old son stay in a game for 168 pitches. Kid probably couldn't wipe his own butt the next day, but he "looked fine" on the mound the day before.
 
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